The Jazz.com Blog
May 19, 2008 · 95 comments
How Bass Solos Ruined Jazz
What's wrong with jazz? Could it be that unwieldy string instrument hiding out next to the drummer? Alan Kurtz, jazz.com's resident curmudgeon (who lately in this column has debunked the idea of a new Golden Age for Jazz and poked a finger in the eye of Record Store Day), now takes on that venerable jazz institution: the bass solo. Below you will find his low, rumbling case against the large wooden elephant in the room that everyone politely avoids discussing. Readers are invited to share their own opinions by adding their comments or emailing them to editor@jazz.com. T.G.
Bass solos suck. Let's face it, the ponderous, unwieldy bottom feeder is the least interesting jazz instrument, lacking even the visual appeal of drum solos. A bulwark in European concert halls since its invention by 16th-century Italian luthiers, the bass violin has by design remained in the background of symphonic and chamber music. Mozart, e.g., composed 40 concertos featuring a solo instrument, including 27 for piano, 5 for violin, 4 for horn, one each for flute, clarinet, oboe and bassoon, but none for bass violin. Likewise in other genres, from folk to pop to country and rock 'n' roll, the acoustic bass serves a supporting role. Only in jazz has it become a principal solo instrument.
Until the 1930s, the string bass was seldom used in jazz, and even then almost never for solos. Since it projects poorly, the acoustic bass mostly provided ballast in lieu of solos that inevitably plunked more than resonated. During the 1940s and early '50s, however, such virtuosos as Jimmy Blanton, Oscar Pettiford and Charles Mingus elbowed their cumbersome instrument into the spotlight. By the mid-'50s, bass solos were de rigueur. Still, the bassist remained primarily an accompanist, not a principal soloist on a par with trumpeters, saxophonists or pianists.
One man changed all that. In the early 1960s, Scott LaFaro, equipped with gargantuan technique and a muscularity suggesting Popeye hopped up on spinach, revolutionized the jazz bass. By imposing his will not just during designated solos, but throughout an entire piece, this brazen bull fiddler in a china shop (otherwise known as the Bill Evans Trio) perversely transformed the conventional trio from a pianist supported by bass and drums to a bassist backed by piano and drums.
It's been said that a jazz band is democracy in microcosm, with each constituent free to express himself. This cliché misconstrues jazz and democracy. An effective group requires both a leader with vision, and participants willing to cooperate towards a common goal. Not everyone can be President simultaneously. This applies to jazz no less than to an entire nation, and is affirmed by Explorations (1961), recorded shortly before Bill Evans abdicated. The highlight, with LaFaro mercifully keeping his monstrous technique in check, is "Elsa," where the diffident pianist is assisted, not overpowered, by his sidemen. "Elsa" isn't democracy in microcosm; it's beauty in macrocosm.
By the summer of 1961, however, Scott LaFaro's coup d'bass was complete. So, as it turned out, was his life. Ten days after a live recording session that would result in two Bill Evans Trio albums, the 25-year-old LaFaro accidentally drove his car at high speed into a tree in upstate New York, killing himself and a passenger.
Accordingly, Evans's next release, Sunday at the Village Vanguard, served as what producer Orrin Keepnews called "a fitting memorial to the abbreviated career of a talented bassist." The follow-up Waltz for Debby was "perhaps more representative of the overall repertoire of the group."
Although Evans's playing is breathtakingly beautiful, LaFaro dominates the proceedings, abetted by his nominal boss, whose tendency towards introspection made him a pushover for the bully fiddler in his midst. Thus, LaFaro consumes 30% of the five Sunday at the Village Vanguard tracks where he solos, and monopolizes a similar percentage of Waltz for Debby. Cumulatively, even factoring in three tracks on which he doesn't solo, LaFaro hogs nearly 25% (19.5 minutes) of the trio's 80-minute, 2-LP performance. This is way beyond showcasing. It's more like Godzilla Goes Trick or Treating. Through sheer brute force, Scott LaFaro had hijacked the Bill Evans Trio.
In December 2007, jazz blogger and occasional Jazz.com contributor Marc Myers reported that pianist Lennie Tristano once walked out in the middle of an Evans/LaFaro club date. "Apparently the perfection of the Bill Evans Trio," Myers speculated, "was too much for Lennie's ego." As long as we're imputing unknowable motives to dead people, let me suggest a contrary spin. In 1962, Tristano objected in the pages of Down Beat to the burgeoning star complex among rhythm sections. "Nowadays there are no sidemen left," Lennie kvetched. "Everyone is a soloist." Tristano most likely fled not out of bruised pride, but in protest to LaFaro's Paul Bunyan-esque ax wielding. With Babe the Bull Fiddle at his side, Scott LaFaro cleared the forest of interested listeners faster than splatter-movie loggers armed with Texas chainsaws.
In any case, LaFaro's legacy was widespread and long-lasting. Never again would jazz bassists be relegated to a lowly supporting role. Henceforth, in a grand triumph of vanity over common sense, everyone would be a soloist, and every soloist would be a star. Now across the land would resound the thumps, thwacks and thuds of bull fiddlers brutishly boring ever-diminishing audiences into deep, dull submission. All in all, an unfitting memorial to the abbreviated career of a talented but overreaching musician. And a dismal development for jazz.
This blog entry posted by Alan Kurtz.
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95 responses so far
Alan: One possible explanation for Tristano walking out on the famed Evans trio was his dislike for the interactive styles of both Motian and LaFaro! In an interview I did with Jack Reilly, an under appreciated pianist and composer and a former Tristano student, he told me Lennie apparently didn't use a rhythm section in that manner. Scott La Faro would probably not be a good match for Lennie. To quote Jack on Motian: "In fact, when Paul Motian played—he played once (with Lennie) and Lennie told him to stop all the other stuff and he was quite annoyed and I don't know if he lasted the week or not, it was at the Half Note, and he had come in to sub for somebody. He stayed a few days but I don't know if he was ever invited back to play with Lennie.""... Lennie had so much going on in his head that anything that was not just strict time would interfere with the way he wanted to express himself at the piano."
There is very smart assessment of Tristano's attitude toward rhythm sections, recently published by Ethan Iverson at this link. He examines in detail Tristano's well-known complaints about bassists and (especially) drummers. But as Iverson points out, Tristano's primary obsession was with having an even, steady beat.
By the way, I will be publishing a Tristano 'dozens' in these (virtual) pages in the near future.
Whether or not bass solos are inherently boring depends, IMO, on how moldy your figs are. If you confine your listening within the bounds allowed by the Burns/Marsalis/Crouch mafia, then, yeah, there are lots of boring bass solos [not to mention boring drum solos, boring sax solos, boring piano solos etc. etc.] that one could do without. (On the other hand, Cecil McBee could play a two-note ostinato for an hour and make it sound utterly fascinating...) However, if you wander a few steps off the rez, you should have no problem finding dozens of bass violinists whose solos are the equal of any horn player's. The first three names that come to mind: Barry Guy Simon H. Fell Reuben Radding. ...and any regular visitor to Paris Transatlantic, Point of Departure, or--if I may mention it in this neighborhood--Bagatellen could easily come up with a list of ten or twenty more...
For kicks read this essay again substituting 'bass' with piano, trumpet, or sax. Pretty wacky. Or for even more fun try 'white guys', 'black guys', 'chick singers'! For me, it comes down to the player. The instrument is only a tool for communication. But there may be another factor at play... The common practice of having a bass solo [and drums solos, fours, eights, etc.] after all the other players have done their bit is real tired. And especially tiring when employed tune after tune. Even if the players are great and not playing basses. Also, regarding Waltz for Debby - if LaFaro's solos take 25% of the time, one can surmise [I'll be damned if I'll listen with a stop watch in hand] that the head statements/drum bits took another 25%, leaving 50% of the time for Evan's solos. Not so unbalanced from my perspective.
even idiots have an opinion
What's yours?
Taking a grain of truth and expanding in an attempt to justify a narrow position on a complex and wide ranging subject entire subject does not constitute a worthwhile argument. There is wild exaggeration in this essay, and some willful ignorance. That said, there is that grain of truth, and that has been taken in the direction of justification for a kind of "conversational" piano trio playing in which the conversation consists of three people talking at once, ostensibly on the same subject, though how anyone could tell is more than I can hear. When this kind of thing works - musicians being flexible about quickly exchanging roles and filling in each other's breathing spaces with beautiful comments of appropriate length, it is among the most creative and unique qualities in a jazz trio. Bill Charlap's trio, among contemporary groups, gets this perfectly. I was the bass player with Lennie Tristano and Paul Motian at the performance that was referred to in an earlier post. Both Paul and I lasted the entire engaement (a week or two - I'm not sure I remember which). The music and none of the interactivity of Bill's trio, nor its swing. As interesting as Lennie's music was, from a cerebral point of view, it left me cold on an emotional level. I did my job keeping time and playing bass notes for him to use as a motor. A machine could have done almost as well.
aking a grain of truth and expanding in an attempt to justify a narrow position on a complex and wide ranging subject does not constitute a worthwhile argument. There is wild exaggeration in this essay, and some willful ignorance. That said, there is that grain of truth, and that has been taken by some in the direction of justification for a kind of "conversational" piano trio playing in which the conversation consists of three people talking at once, ostensibly on the same subject, though how anyone could tell is more than I can hear. When this kind of thing works - musicians being flexible about quickly exchanging roles and filling in each other's breathing spaces with beautiful comments of appropriate length, it is among the most creative and unique qualities in a jazz trio. Bill Charlap's trio, among contemporary groups, gets this perfectly. I was the bass player with Lennie Tristano and Paul Motian at the performance that was referred to in an earlier post. Both Paul and I lasted the entire engaement (a week or two - I'm not sure I remember which). The music and none of the interactivity of Bill's trio, nor its swing. As interesting as Lennie's music was, from a cerebral point of view, it left me cold on an emotional level. I did my job keeping time and playing bass notes for him to use as a motor. A machine could have done almost as well. This has been re-read and corrected. Sorry for the errors in the first post. Chuck
Listening to, enjoying, and understanding jazz bass solos requires a deep appreciation for music and a keen musical mind. Obviously, these are qualities that the author lacks. Way to be a narrow minded, self proclaimed jazz aficionado, your rants truly help to educate the public.
i think what attempts to ruin jazz (i do not believe that it has already been ruined) are people who are neither musicians nor artists (though perhaps they're frustrated artists and musicians) attempting to write about jazz and offering opinions on things they can only speculate about yet have no first hand knowledge of.
This blog is just plan stupid. ^Phil^ is right. And beyond the author not possessing the musical mind to understand bass solos, he obviously doesn't understand the concept of musical freedom. Who appointed him "the god of jazz" and who is he to say what instrument is relevant in a solo setting?
"Bass solos suck." I hope you have written this piece in an effort to solicit a response, and not from the perspective of belittling Scott LaFaro's and Bill Evans' contribution to the art of jazz. Your stated assumptions are quite faulty. In most of the music from the LaFaro-Evans-Motian trio the bass is an equal to, and soloing constantly with the piano (100 percent), creating the actual fabric of the music. In these recordings and most of the music of the Bill Evans Trios, the bassist and drummer have evolved past the mundane roles of time keeping and outlining the chord changes. All three were knowledgeable enough with the specific form, harmony, and melodic potential (of the "tune") and trusted each other explicitly. Bill recognized a potential with Scott LaFaro and encouraged his equal participation. This concept was carried on by Eddie Gomez, spending eleven years with Bill, and then with Marc Johnson until Bill's sudden (but not unexpected) death. The main point is they did their thing without lapsing into so-called free jazz. The comparison of Lennie Tristano with Bill is like apples and oranges. Each had entirely different musical goals and used a different set of methods to pursue those goals. Bill had formal classical training and his piano virtuosity is still marveled at today by jazz pianists and those from the other side of the musical fence. Lennie's training was less formal and he pursued mostly a solo piano career, experimenting with tonalities inherent in the constant bebop line. Lennie's ideas were easily transferable to other single line instruments such as saxophone as exemplified by Lee Konitz and Warne Marsh. Bill's conversational trio concept was passed on to other trios but usually "led" by piano or guitar and his innovations were harmonic and well as melodic and texture-specific, but also deeply rooted in piano technique such as "touch" and the subtle counterpoint of bringing out a melodic line within the changing chords. A fan once told Bill Evans that he had "finally developed the special skills to understand" Bill's music. In a rare conversational response Bill told the fan in few words than no "special skills" were needed, but perhaps the ability to listen on deeper level. You are listening on a severely curtailed and simplistic level that has not kept pace with the evolution of jazz and I sincerely hope that you can catch up.
So basically what I get out of this is that the author is trying to somehow "prove" that bass solos are 1. boring, 2. ruining jazz, and 3. dominating these "poor, defenseless bands." He makes the bass player out to be this awful criminal who takes a band hostage and uses them as a backing for their solo. Now, I think pretty much anybody who knows anything about jazz can tell you that this is NOT the case. Personally, I find "solo" bass players to have some of the most tasteful projects and playing styles out of all kinds of jazz. This guy seems to just be on some kind of personal vendetta against the bass. What a waste of bandwidth.
I also think that bass solos are to be blamed for global worming. You have an opinion but you state it as a fact and don't bring any good examples. I dislike writings that follow this style....
Bass solos arn't the cause, they are the sysmptom. Jazz started getting sick in about 1938 and was firmly dead by 1950. EVERYTHING since then has stunk.
I wonder how many bass players are going to fall for this very nicely written sucker bait. Congratulations, Mr. Kurtz.
Interesting piece of sophistry, on many levels. This article is also noteworthy in its obsession on one particular bassist. While Scott La Faro was a wonderfully ambitious player, he was also just one of the many players who have pursued a solo voice on the bass over the past several decades. The article demonstrates an unfortunate lack of listening breadth and depth. A great example of someone developing specious general conclusions from an isolated musical incident (taken out of context) and their subjective tastes. Perhaps some more insightful topics could be comprised by exploring the effects of: - removal of jazz from the dance hall - the lasting effects of "free jazz" - the constraining effects of a troubled economy and conservative culture on wider artistic exploration. But decrying bass solos as a corrosive effect in jazz? Provocative, yes. Thoughtful or true? I think not.
i have to agree with post no. 16 in that it's fairly obvious that the author wrote a controversial article in order to elicit many responses in order to justify his position as a contributor to this website. trolling...
Alan Kurtz sucks.
What a doofus. Good luck finding a bass player, Mister Doofus.
While you may be correct #18, its fairly obvious that as a result of this article I will be boycotting this site. It's nothing but a bunch of junk made to illicit an angry response. I will tell all my musician friends to do the same.
This is undoubtedly a troll article, and one not even as subtle as Andy Rooney. However, I agree that bass solos are generally gratuitous and unnecessary, and this has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that I cannot get my fingers to do what is in my head. And neither does it have to do with that if I could get my fingers to do what is in my head, that solo would suck, too.
What a GENIUS way to draw more bass players to this site. Next month: "Why the Kazoo isn't a legitimate instrument for use in jazz." Hope you've got lots of bandwidth!
The way you speak of LaFaro as a hulking bully is absurdly inaccurate. Both by Evans' and Motian's accounts, LaFaro not only contributed to a PART of the group, but helped Evans to find his own voice as a musician. To dismiss the sheer musicality of LaFaro's playing as 'bullying' the group is blind ignorance. Just LISTEN to the records! LaFaro lays back when Evans wants to say something, just as Evans does for him. Their trio truly was 'three as one,' rather than one hulking bassist hijacking them for his own musical ambitions. Evans believed that he helped to 'channel' LaFaro's youthful ambition and excitement for music, where in turn, LaFaro stimulated Evans musically. And as for bass solos 'ruining' jazz? You make yourself sound like a complete moron. I'm gonna go listen to some Mingus.
its just a bummer that a site with the web address "jazz.com" could post such garbage. you'd think the first requirement for a contributing editor on such a site would be a knowledge of jazz which the author, Alan Kurtz, clearly does not have. i know it's not a magazine, or an "article" per se, its just a blog, that's why its important to take advantage of the features of this blog and leave comments at the bottom of the page letting unsuspecting readers know that this guy does not speak for jazz musicians, jazz critics, and probably knows nothing about jazz at all. many readers may wrongly assume that because he posts there that he's some sort of authority, when in reality, any idiot can post on the internet (hence this post). he even says in his profile that he's not a musician and he's not a writer. the fact he's just heard jazz before seems to be his only qualification. (perhaps i should start writing for a medical journal since i've been to the doctor before) we should take advantage of the features of the the blog and post the counter arguement at the bottom. the scary thing is if you google this guy, it looks like he's trying to make a name for himself as a jazz writer of some sort, and he's attracting criticism other places on the web too. the part that confuses me is that you'd think that jazz.com would be trying to attract members of the jazz community rather than alienate them. as far as im concerned, after reading that post, jazz.com is garbage for allowing it. jazz in general faces enough challenges. it doesnt need another dope running around doing more damage, especially on a site that seems like it would want to advocate for jazz. one really cool thing though, chuck israels posted on it!
blah!
you are retarded, why not call the article "I Hate Bass Players"? Have you listened to Jaco or John Patitucci? If you say those cat's can not play, I question your knowledge of jazz bassist.
wow, chuck israels! frankly i have nothing to add, i think "don't feed the trolls" said it best already. it's pretty damn sad to see something like this on jazz.com
Kurtz is an incompetent troll, everything he writes erodes his, as well as Gioia's credibility. Let's hope somebody wakes up in time.
My goodness. What a sad article. Bill Evans trio recordings with Scott LaFaro are beautiful things. It's a tragedy the author can't hear it. :-(
I haven't read anything this stupid since middle school. Have fun with all that credibility that you will have gained from writing something this stupid, it's really going to help out your career. You are a complete idiot. Oh, whoops, did I just use a blanket statement? Not that you would know anything about those. I hope you die.
It's most disappointing to see Ted Gioia associated with this pointless exercise.
Nothing wrong with feeding a troll, especially a stupid one. At the very least, it makes him feel like his opinion matters, and a best case scenario might see him leave his mother's basement and enter the real world.
Please let me sincerely thank everyone who has commented upon my inciteful "Have Bass Solos Ruined Jazz?" Jazz.com is less than 6 months old, but your spirited response sets a new record for visitor comments to any of our blog postings, feature articles, interviews or reviews. I must, however, correct a few factual errors in one comment and respond to unfounded insinuations elsewhere in this lively thread.
FACTUAL: "The comparison of Lennie Tristano with Bill Evans is like apples and oranges," writes Win Hinkle. "Bill had formal classical training and his piano virtuosity is still marveled at today by jazz pianists and those from the other side of the musical fence. Lennie's training was less formal and he pursued mostly a solo piano career." First, I never compared Tristano with Evans. I merely recounted the story of Tristano walking out in the middle of an Evans club date, and contrasted another writer's interpretation of that walkout with my own. Second, it's untrue that Tristano had less formal training than Evans. Bill attended Southeastern Louisiana University on a music scholarship, earning a degree in piano performance and teaching. He later did postgraduate study in composition at the Mannes College of Music. Lennie Tristano graduated from the prestigious American Conservatory of Music, one of the oldest music schools in the U.S. This may be oranges and tangerines, but it sure ain't apples and oranges. Third, if Tristano "pursued mostly a solo piano career," it would come as news to his distinguished longtime sidemen Lee Konitz and Warne Marsh. Fourth, Jazz.com's editor-in-chief Ted Gioia (himself a pianist) will be publishing a Tristano appreciation in the near future on this site, and I fully expect him to marvel at Lennie's virtuosity. Win Hinkle should stick to Bill Evans and forgo discussing Lennie Tristano.
INSINUATIONS: Bill R associates me with what he calls the "Burns/Marsalis/Crouch mafia," and suggests that I ought to "wander a few steps off the rez" to find worthwhile bass solos. In a single comment, Bill R manages to slur three ethnic groups: (1) African Americans, by tying Wynton Marsalis and Stanley Crouch to the Mafia; (2) Italian Americans by using "mafia" not in a historically descriptive sense but simply as a putdown; (3) Native Americans with the offensive term "rez" and its reminder that those confined thereon must receive permission to wander even a few steps away. In any case, I've never had any personal contact with Messrs. Burns, Marsalis and Crouch, although I admire their work from afar.
"Kurtz is an incompetent troll," claims Damon Smith. Hey, I don't like to brag, but if we define troll as someone who posts controversial messages in order to bait others into emotional responses, I'd say "Have Bass Solos Ruined Jazz?" demonstrates, if nothing else, my competence in that regard.
"It's fairly obvious," adds respondent S, "that the author wrote a controversial article in order to elicit many responses in order to justify his position as a contributor to this website." This may be obvious to S, but not to anyone here at Jazz.com. As a contributing editor, I have written 600 reviews of my own (spanning 90 years of jazz recordings) and edited 700 reviews by other contributors. By comparison, I have posted a grand total of 4 blog entries. Rest assured that my occasional guest blogs in no way justify my position, which is securely based on reviewing and editing, not blogging.
Finally, someone who signs himself Congratulations, You are A Dumbass succinctly sums up most of the 3 dozen comments submitted: "I hope you die." Please just be patient, sir. I am 63 years old. In due course I shall certainly die, but not as a result of your wishes.
Kurtz is an incompetent troll," claims Damon Smith. Hey, I don't like to brag, but if we define troll as someone who posts controversial messages in order to bait others into emotional responses, I'd say "Have Bass Solos Ruined Jazz?" demonstrates, if nothing else, my competence in that regard."........................................................ if this is the purpose of writing the article, then that is truely pathetic. especially on a site that pretends to be a site for serious jazz lovers......................................................................................Please let me sincerely thank everyone who has commented upon my inciteful "Have Bass Solos Ruined Jazz?" Jazz.com is less than 6 months old, but your spirited response sets a new record for visitor comments to any of our blog postings, feature articles, interviews or reviews...........................i dont think that having people flame you for 33 posts and turning off many people to this site permanently is anything to be proud of. make no mistake, you did not generate these posts yourself. there is a thread on talkbass which has been viewed over 800 times since yesterday that brought the traffic here, and i suspect that many of those people will never return. i for one am done with this site, the editor, and the author of this blog.
I love satire!
I stand corrected: Kurtz is a troll of the highest order, brimming with competence. It is his writing about jazz that lacks professionalism. What we are seeing is Ted Gioia sacrificing the credibility his books could have brought to this site for a couple hundred web hits. What would Red Mitchell have thought of this travesty, Mr West Coast jazz? If I want to read what basically amounts to idiotic frat boy antics I'll go over to http://www.tuckermax.com where the antics and writing are at a much higher level. Congrats on turning jazz.com into a low brow humor site/equirer style tabloid. I am sure "Billy Holiday Births three headed Martian baby" would get you some hits as well. Why not go whole hog?
Why don't we get this many responses when we blog about jazz in Estonia or remember the finer moments of Jabbo Smith?
I have to admit that I might, possibly, share some of Alan Kurtz's opinion that Scott Lafaro might, possibly, some of the time, have played too damn much. But this is where the article fails as satire, for me: LaFaro is described as "Popeye hopped up on spinach," a "brazen bull fiddler in a china shop," a "bully fiddler," "Godzilla," and the 'hijacker' of the Evans Trio through "sheer brute force." We also read a rather flippant description of LaFaro's fatal accident which is - he "drove his car at high speed into a tree in upstate New York, killing himself and a passenger." There's an unfortunate consistency of language here. It seems as if there's an implied causality between LaFaro's muscular performance - and, by extension, his character - and his untimely death. Note the use of the active voice: Kurtz doesn't say that Lafaro 'died' in the crash, but that he 'killed himself' (and another!) by driving into the tree 'at high speed.' As if he were Wile E. Coyote, I guess. Even in the context, that's simply in poor taste. Conflating the artist's character with their work is a critical fallacy that's all too easy to fall into (satire or no satire). There's an excellent podcast of an interview with Ben Ratliff discussing his Coltrane book where Ratliff talks about how Coltrane's death, at the height of his free period, muddied the waters for critics; how it became impossible to separate the arc of Coltrane's art and his life and, uh, holy transcendance and so on. So Coltrane's death either results in invoking reverence for the master, or quite the opposite: "Let's just get the hell away from that kind of music because that's the trap.' (That interview can be found here: http://stream.publicbroadcasting.net/ros/BenRatliff.mp3) By the way: "insightful."
You're stupid... I play bass solos, what's wrong with that? It's a lot better than the stupid modal solos all the saxaphonists do on BOP heads! I'm the only one who can actually play bebop, so our bandleader lets me solo, and it always goes down fine. Oh, and LeFaro is amazing, you're just upset because you're more of a music critic than you are a musician... try playing a double bass, and see if you could ever play like any of the greats!
"Why don't we get this many responses when we blog about jazz in Estonia or remember the finer moments of Jabbo Smith?" because controversy garners attention and breeds commentary unfortunately for you guys, manufactured controversy (what we on the interweb here call trolling) erodes credibility
One last thing.... sax solos, trumpet solos, etc all sound so great because of the bassist playing in the back, allowing them to bounce thier ideas off of the rhythm section, often a bassist has no accompaniment except for drums, so a bassist and sax player could play the same solo, and it would sound much better from the saxaphonist.
Fricken hoot, at least it's a new theory. Takes pressure of the bebop horn players
C'mon, guys, Mr. Kurtz is a "music critic", a profession that competes in credibility with "UFO expert". Neither can rely on anything resembling the validity of their arguments, so the focus must be on how colorfully the arguments are presented. Would love to stay to read the rest of the site, but I need to have Joan Rivers tell me what fashion accessories are ruining the Oscars.
I find it ironic that at the time of this posting, there are 2 featured interviews with two bassists: Esperanza Spalding and Ben Allison. Why didn't the interviewers do them a favor and tell them that their soloing was a waste of time, after all their playing is just "brutishly boring".
Seriously? Bass solos are cool. Whatever
One of the respondents is correct about my knowledge of Tristano being limited. But, there is a major indicator that this Kurtz troll is not knowledgeable of music, especially jazz and would help things by staying away from it - his statement "lacking even the visual appeal of drum solos." Does this jerk expect jazz musicians to provide visual appeal? If so he never learned how to LISTEN.
The instrument that your article refers to is not a contrabass violin, it is a double bass. The term contrabass is used to denote the lowest pitch sounding instrument in a family of instruments. Violins are made within a very tight range of geometric shapes, (i.e. standard proportions), although the overall size can vary (childrens instruments, etc.), and violins are tuned in fifths. Double basses are generally not contrabass violins - the shapes are highly non-standard and with the exception of a very small minority of players (such as Red Mitchell, Joel Quarrington) the double bass is tuned in fourths. Perhaps Mr Kurtz can solve his dilema regarding bass solos by purchasing midi-file performances instead of CDs. Then he can reprogram the bass solos into any other instrument voicing that he prefers to listen to.
Why don't you go hang out with the guy on the forums who was writing about how Coltrane couldn't play and is over rated. Yup, a lot of great critics on this site.
Jeez, Alan, for someone who repeatedly posts articles whose sole discernible purpose is to be as offensive & irritating as possible, you’re awfully sensitive to the dictates of political correctness. However, before I rush to offer my mea culpas [sorry if that offends Catholics], I think I’ll wait to see if any members of the groups for which you have appointed yourself the Great White Spokesman [sorry if that offends Caucasians] take exception to my remarks. Nice job of evading any substantive response to your critics, though. I can see why Gioia hired you.
seriously? should all the bari sax, bass trombonists & bass clarinet players heed this as a warning of a darker less bottom friendly future? since when does the instrument the solo was played on matter more than the notes/soul of the solo itself? ??? the sheer fact that you took the time to slice up 'waltz for debby' with your stopwatch (so as to verbally illustrate your point in 'pie-chart' form) is pathetic ... i'm sorry i wasted my time in reading it all the way thru ...
I'm surprised that jazz.com would publish this. The graphics that accompany it are sophomoric and of poor quality. I am left how much jazz (live or otherwise) the author actually listens to.
Left *wondering* just how much jazz the author listens to, and how well he understands the genre. Really pitiful writing, regardless of whether one agrees that bass solos suck. A high school debating team member could have made a better essay out of this.
Alan Kurtz is ruining Jazz.com every time he turns on his stereo and sits down at his computer to write. He needs to be stopped, as it is obvious from the responses to this article that he is not luring any new readers to the website, only alienating the ones who have been here previously. His writing lacks credibility, he lacks integrity, and he needs to be stopped. This is not cute, this is not funny. It is embarrassing. He should be ashamed of himself, and Jazz.com should be ashamed for publishing his garbage.
Poorly written, poorly argued, and sad that someone from a website called "jazz.com" would write something this ignorant. Critics like you ruin jazz, not the musicians.
This is the same elitist type mentality that makes for some of the finest of dictatorships. Maybe you should be in politics instead of music. Yes, there are most certainly some huge egos out there but they come clanging along as the elephant in the room with ALL kinds of instruments. Either way, music is the deepest and most intimate of "personal" expression. I have heard MANY brilliant and beautifully moving bass solos and bass compositions. Likewise, one could say that frustrated musicians turned writers whose main instruments are arrogance and blatant ignorance should maybe stick to movie reviews right where they would best fit. Good luck with that.
Someone has obviously not listened to jazz recorded in the past 40 years. Jaco Pastorius. Stanley Clarke. Marcus Miller. Bunny Brunel. Ron Carter. Victor Wooten. Michael Manring. Edger Meyer. Ray Brown. Charles Mingus. John Patitucci. I could go on forever. There are hundreds more. You've proven to this bass player that you are completely out of touch with the modern jazz scene my friend. Good luck living in the past.
http://www.thetherapist.com/Kurtz_File.html
I'm not sure, but I think the preceding link breaches patient/therapist confidentiality. I'm disappointed in Dr. Charles Balis, whom I once trusted with my innermost secrets, but who has obviously betrayed me. And all because I fell behind in my payments! Dr. Balis knew from the outset that $150 an hour was more than I could afford, but he took me on regardless. I see now that it was part of his plan to gather material for his web site. So much for medical ethics.
just could not imagine Red without Paul.
Everyone is certainly entitled to their opinions. But playing "cute" with the facts is uncalled for. Stating that Scott "drove his car into a tree at high speed, killing himself" is simply a nasty statement, contrary to reality. Scotty, after playing at the Newport Jazz Festival, instead of returning directly to NYC, went to his hometown to carry out a mission for our Mom. (He was a great family guy and head of a family of 5 since our dad died in 1957). He had too little sleep for four days and fell asleep at the wheel, crashing into a tree which was at a curve on a dark two lane rural road. Police investigation showed no evidence of excessive speed.
Ms. LaFaro-Fernandez, I earnestly apologize for offending you with my description of your brother's automobile accident. My use of the term "high speed" was based not on police reports but on the shocking newspaper photograph of what was left of his car following the impact. I never stated and did not mean to imply that his speed was excessive. But, with all due respect and with my heartfelt condolences to you and your family for this tragic loss, the accident did demolish the vehicle and, far worse, kill its two occupants. Irrespective of road conditions or the driver's prolonged sleep deprivation, it seems implausible that a car crashing at either slow or moderate speed could have produced such a horrendous outcome.
So, Mr. Kurtz, now you're an accident scene expert who can refute a police report based on a snapshot in a 47 year-old newspaper? You can't even issue a simple apology to Scott's sister for your flippant description of her brother's death. It's not hard to read between the lines and recognize a person who believes he's an expert on just about everything.
Ms. Crouch, I appreciate your comment, but have you seen the news photo in question? http://www.hipjazz.com/images/newsphotoGenevaTimes7-6-61.jpg
While it's unclear from the Geneva Times account whether the two victims died as a result of the impact or the fire that ensued, the crash obviously caused significant structural damage to the vehicle. One doesn't have to be an accident-scene investigator to conclude that this was no fender bender. And, truly, Ms. Crouch, my description of Scott LaFaro's death was in no way flippant, as you allege. Here's what I wrote: "Ten days after a live recording session that would result in two Bill Evans Trio albums, the 25-year-old LaFaro drove his car at high speed into a tree in upstate New York, killing himself and a passenger." I suggest you stop reading between the lines and pay closer attention to what I actually wrote.
You conveniently left out the previous sentence: "By the summer of 1961, however, Scott LaFaro's coup d'bass was complete. So, as it turned out, was his life." Lovely. Readers, and Mr. Expert, I rest my case.
I intentionally (not conveniently) omitted those two (not one) sentences because you had objected to my "flippant description of her brother's death." Neither of the quoted sentences describes LaFaro's death. The first refers to his bass playing. The second states straightforwardly that his life was complete; it does not depict his demise. However, if you are now objecting to those two sentences, please tell me where's the flippancy? Before resting your case, counselor, you ought to make one.
Dude, you dug yourself a hole. Now lie in it and shut the f**k up. You are an embarassment.
An embarrassment to whom? At least I can express myself without resorting to words with asterisks in the middle. And I am not your dude, Richard.
This is clearly a joke, if not it's not worth reading, nor is the author ever worth listening to. But back to the joke theory, my favourite part is "This cliché misconstrues jazz and democracy" I didn't know I was going against democracy by trying to take bass solos and helpfully contribute to overall sound of the band! Funny article.
Mr. Kurtz, you're a dick
The immediately preceding back-to-back comments from Niels Oersted-Henning Pedersen and nathanmcnathan provide a stark contrast. Mr. Pedersen gets it, and offers an articulate reply. nathanmcnathan, on the other hand, joins the long list of respondents to this blog who merely insult me without contributing anything meaningful to the discussion. In this ongoing stream of vitriol, I have been variously called stupid, retarded, a doofus, a complete moron and a complete idiot. And now, of course, a dick.
In his June 10 blog, JAZZ.COM IS SIX MONTHS OLD, this web site's editor-in-chief Ted Gioia stressed that "diversity is a core value here." He noted the geographic distribution of our writers and the variety of their opinions. I think it's safe to presume that our readership is likewise geographically dispersed. But readers' core values vis-à-vis diversity of opinion are another matter entirely.
The consensus of closed minds evinced by most respondents to "How Bass Solos Ruined Jazz" is disappointing. I expected more from people interested in jazz, which itself encourages diversity of all types, including the expression of opinion.
And perhaps therein lies the rub. Many of you either ignore or fail to grasp the distinction between fact-based blogging – such as Jazz.com's frequent reports on concerts, festivals, conventions, etc. – and opinion-based blogging. This leads to charges that my writing lacks integrity, credibility and professionalism. Those qualities are essential to fact-based blogging, but I consider them irrelevant to my own opinion blogging, which aims to entertain and stimulate, not demonstrate my bona fides.
I believe in free expression. If that includes being called stupid, retarded, doofus, moron, idiot and dick, then so be it. I only wish Jazz.com's most vocal readers were a more tolerant bunch, and that they shared even a smattering of Niels Oersted-Henning Pedersen's sense of humor.
Yeah, bass solos suck. Your opinion. I thought the whole read was rather funny though. As in, it was an apparent try at a humorous read. Jazz is all about freedom to me. Which is why even the more supportive instruments can take front stage and show their creative forces. Why is this a bad thing? In my eyes the bass is a beautiful instrument, and bass solos can be quite simply stunning.
I get it. You don't like bass solos. I like bass solos. There's no accounting for taste.
Alan Kurtz is clearly gay
Hey Mr. Krurtz, have you read my other comments? I merely added the part about you being a dick because that seems to be the general consensus around here. Just remember, you're a music critic, and I can actually play instruments! So what fiy uo don't like bass solos, doesn't mean you have to write an article on how the "ruined" jazz. What if I wrote an article on how your writing ruined jazz.com? Also, your therapist thinks that you're an egotistical nutjob? Nice!
You left out paranoid. I know all you people are talking about me behind my back.
Mr. Kurtz, Mr. Gioia has defended these types of opinionated bullshit blog entries by saying "he made his points using humor. That's a valid way of expressing an intelligent opinion...I thought his views were provocative and amusing. I still do. Of course, I also knew that they would generate controversy." Well, the controversy has been generated, sir. And it is not at all productive, as we all can tell. You continually respond by the remarks of the readers in defense of yourself, and you strike out at what you consider to be a lack of intelligence on the part of the readers. Well, instead of doing that, why don't you look into the mirror. There would be no reactions like these if you hadn't written an aritcle of such poor quality and in the first place. Once someone steps up and applauds your efforts here, then maybe the attacks at you will cease. Mr. Pederson's response "This is clearly a joke, if not it's not worth reading, nor is the author ever worth listening to" is not a compliment to you or your article. He clearly states that you, as the author of this shit, are not "EVER WORTH LISTENING TO." Regardless if you think you are joking or not, you come across as an opinionated, bigoted, pompous ass. As Mr. Pederson says, "this is clearly a joke"--how can any self-respecting "critic" appreciate his/her work being called a "joke"? Of your 1000s of reviews and articles on this website, I think it is safe to say that the vast majority of what you write is not worth the time it takes to read. How about doing some stats on that instead of counting the seconds of bass solos on Bill Evans records. I'll start the over under at 5.5%. Oh yeah, and now you are insulting the family members of famous musicians. Well done. Take the hint, Mr. Kurtz. Please stop. Create your controversy somewhere else, like maybe in your bedroom with some imaginary friends, or at a tea party with your favorite stuffed animals, or in your shrink's office, and leave Jazz.com to the writers who actually have something intelligent to say. How about this, my fellow readers? If Mr. Kurtz truly gets off on the responses we leave here him on the site, why don't we all just stop? Let him sit idle, miserable, unappreciated and unrecognized. This is how a man who lacks character should be treated. Neglect this sad, little man. Boycott Alan Kurtz.
Don't you just love the way someone who insists on remaining anonymous can expend 419 words advising everyone else to stop feeding this troll? Thank goodness such anonymities never practice what they preach. How else would we know they exist?
I don't know Mr Kurt, but he could never had listen to Paul Chambers, Doug Watkins, Ray Brown or Percy Heath
The critics of this article seem to have a difficult time expressing themselves without profanity. (Or should I say the same person posting over and over again under different aliases seems to have a problem with profanity?) Please note that these crude postings will be deleted. There seems to be quite a contrast, I should add, between Mr. Kurtz’s writing, which is handled in a humorous manner, and the troglodyte postings of his adversaries. Defenders of the bass, I suggest you raise the level of your dialogue. Posting rants ten times over (or one hundred times over) under different names is not a substitute for reasoned discourse.
Alan, you're a curmudgeon. If you're just trying to be provocative, you win. I think Ray Brown is one example of a tasty "accompanist" that also had no trouble with beautiful, thought provoking, innovative, valuable solos. I am sure Oscar Peterson would concur.
Mr Wilson, to that I add, listen to Way Out West
I hope this discussion goes on for a while! I didn't know that we bassplayers could actually ruin jazz! If I would have known I would have practiced harder :)
Mr. Kurtz, the charge that your writing lacks professionalism is likely a result of your unforgiving tone. Whether you intended this article to be funny or not, most of your essay is dedicated to the issue of Scott LaFaro's overplaying--at least 25%!--and the conclusion states, "Now across the land would resound the thumps, thwacks and thuds of bull fiddlers brutishly boring ever-diminishing audiences into deep, dull submission." Furthermore, you've accused some responders of closed-mindedly insulting you without "contributing anything meaningful to the discourse." You're right; many of the responses to your essay were unhelpful and rude. However, your own piece began with the words "Bass solos suck." Mr. Kurtz, you opened the flood gates by insulting a valued portion of the jazz community without contributing anything meaningful to the discourse.
Robert, I appreciate your comment, which is distinguished by a civility absent from most of your predecessors in this thread. However, your first sentence suggests that you misunderstand my June 25 reply. I wasn't complaining about being called unprofessional. I said integrity, credibility and professionalism are irrelevant to my opinion blogging, which aims to entertain and stimulate, not demonstrate my bona fides. There are plenty of writers on the Internet, on this web site and elsewhere, with more than enough integrity, credibility and professionalism to do justice to jazz. I can't compete with those guys. But I don't want to, and haven't tried. Instead, I'm carving out my own niche as a nonprofessional provocateur.
So far, I'm succeeding. My original May 19 guest blog consisted of 736 words, including title. To date, excluding comments from me and other jazz.com personnel, my blog has generated 70 responses containing (not counting respondent ID and date/time posted) 5,481 words. I'll spare you the math. It's a lopsided ratio of more than 7:1. And all because I dared to question the elevation of acoustic bassists to principal soloists on a par with trumpeters, saxophonists or pianists.
Yet despite an avalanche of vilification from the self-appointed guardians of jazz's sacred cows, and notwithstanding their wishful rumors about my having been summarily hanged, drowned, burned at the stake, guillotined, executed by lethal injection, confined to a high-security psychiatric facility, or abducted to Gitmo, I am not only still here, but my proclivity for taunting is undaunted. If my detractors thought they could intimidate me by branding me a stupid, retarded, moronic, idiotic, doofus dick lacking integrity, credibility and professionalism, they were wrong. I happily plead guilty to all those charges, and more. Now, if they had forced me to listen to post-1960 acoustic bass solos, THAT would have bothered me.
Why can't a bassist be considered a principal soloist? Pianists and guitarists in the rhythm section often have as many solos as the horns, so why is it so hard for you to understand the bassist's need for expression?
Scott Lafaro's bass playing aside, the bass, in my opinion adds a needed bright spot to the jazz sound scape. As a pianist/keyboardist it's refreshing to have a capable bass player who can enhance group interaction. Even if the author of this blog computed the percentage of Lafaro's playing with the trio, it's a piano trio. Given Evan's mastery, Lafaro's playing was as integral as Evans. It's not a coincidence that Evans took nearly an entire year off following his death because he was so devastated by this loss. I think that speaks volumes. It's all opinion but to say that bass solos killed jazz is definitely something I strongly disagree with. To ignore the work of Lafaro is pretty ignorant even if one didn't like his playing. His contributions at such a young age speak for itself.
To that, I include, Amen.
I play electric bass... I hate soloing... what I hate even more is the ridiculous prejudice against Electric Bass in the "Jazz" scene... for some weird reason, I keep getting told to go off and find a "fusion" group...
I've played bass in many jazz groups for over 50 years. The leaders keep asking me to solo. The audience claps after my solos. I think I need to get in my car and run into a tree at high speed.
quite simply the most ignorant thing i have ever had the displeasure to read
Bass is awesome so dont say it 'ruined' jazz! It helped jazz get so popular.
There appears to be some missing logic here. How can the generic term 'bass solos' be held accountable for ruining jazz ? There are only bass players playing jazz solos---some can be deemed 'good' and some 'bad'. As to whether the bass is an 'admissible' instrument upon which to solo, take a look at the harmonica.
One man changed all that. In the early 1960s, Scott LaFaro! What about Jimmy Blanton.!!!!
I believe that most of us responders have played right into Mr. Kurtz's hands, while missing the entire point of this writing. In order to be offended, I have to first believe that Mr. Kurtz is an impartial, all-knowledgeable "authority" on the subject matter, versus a person expressing his/her own PERSONAL opinion. Second, I have to believe that this "authority" is attempting to accurately expound on the subject, in an effort to initially provide or add to an existing body of factual, irrefutable evidence. By the third paragraph, it was clear to me that neither was the case. The bottom line is this: Whether or not "bass solos have ruined jazz" is ABSOLUTELY RELATIVE. It depends on the listener, not some publication's editor. I can no more be angry at Mr. Kurtz for his PERSONAL opinion, than I can expect that a change of opinion on his behalf has an effect on the state of bass solos and their contribution to jazz music. IT'S HIS OPINION, folks. Let him have it. His opinion doesn't change the fact that we bass players are capable of creating beautiful, moving music that contributes richly to the lasting legacy of jazz music. And THAT is MY opinion. Just as Mr. Kurtz is welcome to his, I am welcome to mine, and the fact that I'm not a jazz writer doesn't make my opinion any less valid.